-2 Advice for young guy here to learn.
I am 23 years old.
I have run three previous cycles before first consisting of:
1: 12 weeks Test E 500 mg/wk > Eq 300 mg/wk > nolvadex throughout and 6 weeks after
2: 12 weeks Test Prop 300 mg/wk EOD > Oral winny 50mg ED (4 weeks on 4 weeks off) > Nolva throughout and 6 weeks after
3: 12 weeks Test Prop 300 mg/wk EOD > Masteron prop 300 mg/wk EOD > Oral winny 50mg ED throughout > arimidex 1mg EOD throughout > HCG 4 weeks post cycle > clomid 6 weeks post cycle
Now I know that i am young and i do wish i had waited and done more research before starting so young. However here I am, I'm addicted, im sure many out there can sympathize.
I have started my next cycle and after countless forum searching i have a number of concerns, and i really just want some help/advice from those obviously more knowledgable and experienced than I. I will have blood work done this coming summer, however my testicles have always bounced back to normal size very quickly post cycle, and i have not had any lasting or permanent mood/libido issues.
Here is my current cycle, I am 5 days into the cycle today:
i plan on running this for 16 weeks with a 4 week break on the winny inbetween.
Test Prop 250 mg/wk EOD > Tren Ace 50mg EOD > Proviron 25mg ED > Winstrol 50 mg ED > Arimidex 1mg EOD > HCG 500 iu/wk > Hyper test > ZMA > Livershield
PCT: HCG 500 iu/wk 6 weeks > clomid 25mg ED 6 weeks
Please give me helpful advice and even criticism. But understand i make a living off of this modeling for an agency. I do need your knowledge.
Thank you!!
| Week | Testosterone Enanthate | Pregnyl | Nolvadex |
|---|---|---|---|
| 1 | 500mg | 500UI | |
| 2 | 500mg | 500UI | |
| 3 | 500mg | 500UI | |
| 4 | 500mg | 500UI | |
| 5 | 500mg | 500UI | |
| 6 | 500mg | 500UI | |
| 7 | 500mg | 500UI | |
| 8 | 500mg | 500UI | |
| 9 | 500mg | 500UI | |
| 10 | 500mg | 500UI | |
| 11 | 500UI | ||
| 12 | 500UI | ||
| 13 | 500UI | 20mg | |
| 14 | 500UI | 20mg | |
| 15 | 20mg | ||
| 16 | 20mg | ||
| 17 | 20mg |
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Lol I hear ya on the gh. The real stuff is so expensive man. My entire savings account is basically my gh fund. And you wanna knkw the worst part, you ma know this already but the drug is competely and utterly worhless for muacle gain, (unless you use insulin). So were wasting all this money on an expensive fat burner. Might as well tighten up the diet a bit or buy some clen and save 600 bucks a month
BTW, there's no need to run Pregnyl (HCG) during PCT.
OP has not responded to anything yet. He is just trolling. And by this looks of the heated debate he has trolled very well.
AnonEven if he was trolling it did spark an interesting conversation. Maybe someone else will read this and get something out of it.
Here is my criticism first
First off... "addicted" is a strong word brother, do you really feel you cant lift and be healthy without gear?.. I saw that your 23 and youve done 3 cycles, at 12 weeks on and 12 off thats roughly a year and a half. Does that mean you started cycling between 20 and 21? Like the other members said YOU ARE AT RISK of seriously shutting down your NATURAL hormonal system by using so many compounds, I CANT STRESS THAT ENOUGH. Also i see in the first two cycles that there was no AI, you should always have them on hand....
As for this cycle above
I (personally) like to research the living shit out of anything before i dive into it. Whether its what parts to buy for my car, to what kind of effect certain compounds will have on my body YOU GOTTA DO RESEARCH. Even with research though, some compounds will effect your body different than others.
I AM glad to not see tren in this cycle.
BUT make sure to have an anti estrogen on deck like aromasin or adex
AND if you can, run bloods 4-6 weeks in to make sure everything is ok, YOUR STILL YOUNG you want to keep your body in check
AnonHe is running tren ace, its stated in his post. I understand you are trying to help but he is too young. The best and only advice we can give on this board to men this young is to stop, get bloodwork to make sure you havent fucked yourself, and spend a couple more years researching.
Ahhh... hes just so lazy he couldn't actually put the cycle in the graph properly... i see Jesus.. yeah dude.... #### research research research! # YOU ONLY GET ONE BODY! as far as we know....
So you believe there's a difference betwen use and abuse? I do to, I was an ex opiate addict. Is my situation use or abuse in your opinion? I come off cycle for periods of time, I stay on longer then I shoud, I keep my doses not to high, I do blood work very tegirally and I would like to think I have a decent knowledge of the drugs and there effects.
So am I an addict? Probably, but my steroid use doesn't cause me to lose everything like narcotics did. I could go into detail about how my life was when I was using opiates and how bad it was and how succesful I am I since I quit, started lifting and eventually started using steroids. Put it this way, I've never sold my computer or books for school to buy steroids lol.
AnonUh, man. Looking back at the shit I have done during my addiction makes me sick.
Im pretty sure im addicted to the steroid lifestyle but like you said, I havent sold off my possessions or lost everything because of it. I feel I am very cautious with my steroid use, or at least as cautious as I can be with this stuff. Its a level of responsibility I never practiced in my heroin addiction.
All I know is I don't need to shoot some test prop every morning just to be able to get out of bed, and I am grateful for that. Any ex opiate addict knows what I mean...
Damn right bro, what's the worst feeling being an opiate addict? Waking up in the morning with no drugs and no money and starting to get sick. I never wake up broke, no gear and blow off all my other responsibility to find money to get gear. I'm a normal productive responsible citizen now with a nice savings account ( hgh is killing it tho lol). I'm just like any other person who doesn't use steroid responsible/productive/ trustworthy wise. But you say your catious with your gear use, I find most of us ex addicts tend to push it more, not so much with doses but duration on, less time off , harder compounds earlier on etc. but I do everythjf I can to stay healthy including bloods every 6-8 weeks while I'm on.
AnonI dunno, I guess once I got a little older I have wised up a bit. Im actually more scared of fucking myself up with steroids than I ever was with dope. And that is after 2 near fatal overdoses...fuckin weird lol
AnonAbsolutely
AnonI hear ya man, I'm kinda glad I never found this site when I was younger. That feels like an odd thing to say because I have learned a lot here, but with my mentality at 23 I would probably be on trt by now for sure. I'm glad I waited until I was 27, people really underestimate the results they can get at a young age with a solid diet and training routine.
But anyways, I know we are all in the same boat, I hope the op will make a good choice. Unfortunately that is usually the hardest choice.
I'd like to see you more involved, especially with the younger guys in this type of situation. You've got invaluable experience that's specific and of great value potentially.
FR sent.
AnonI understand what you are saying, and for the most part I agree. I am a recovering addict myself. However, I do not believe he is in here looking for help to stop his addiction. I believe he is looking for someone to enable him to continue what he is doing. I believe he is admitting he has an addiction for the sole purpose of saying "Oh well, I'm addicted so I might as well keep doing what I am doing". The justifications and rationalizations are what allow the behavior to continue. Finding a solution will come from him admitting his addiction as well as seeking a way to end it. He has to be willing to make this change on his own, no one is gonna do it for him.
If he considers himself "addicted"at such a young age that would come across as the sort of unhealthy relationship with steroids you mention you've been involved in. That's what I find a little alarming.
Sounds like you're in a better position to counsel the op than I. Might be worth you pm'ing him etc.
RustyhookerHere to learn? I doubt it. Your post states that you're already running. 3rd cycle and harsh compounds. Time of cycle will mean shutdown. Possibly permanent shutdown.
Anytime we cycle we risk permanent shutdown. You have a higher risk then he does at your age. Not condoning use at his age. Im just sick of the misinformation being spread about it.
Lets give him some real reasons why he shouldn't use steroids other then the line of bullshit that risk of damage to the hpta is higher, which is in fact total bullshit and the exact opposite of the truth. A developing htpa has a significantly higher change of recovering from the damage of a steroid cycle then a 30-40-50 year old. And its only logical, think of how resilient young kids bodys are.
For instance, you're 23, you're still you and going thru changes in your life, using steroids could mean life long consequences and at this age you're not mentally mature enough to make those decisions. This is your focus now, maybe in two years you have a baby and you realize you dont want to use anymore and you wanna be around for your kid, but in the process of using gear you ruined your kidneys, heart, liver etc. or you get shutdown permentally end up on trt, meet a great girl who wants a family but you were the unlucky trt paitent who is sterile. These can be the consequences and should not be made by going people, fuck even at 25 is probably to young to be making these types of decisions. Have I accepted it at 25? I tell myself I have but in reality I believe I'll be ok, I won't fuck myself up and I'll be able to have kids, I won't suffer heart problems later etc.
Thats what you should be telling them, not lies. Waiting till 25 should be because of mental maturity, cause that is actually true. Ok rant over, no disrespect intended rusty .
Lets add to the already misinformation. I am not the same as you, Op is not the same, cat is not the same, e.t.c e.t.c. Everyone may have the same body parts, internals and such but noone has the same tolerances, diseases, hpta, estrogen, test. To say it is misinformati0on that he risks shutdown at his age is false. I have been here long enough to see guys come in here who ran 1 oral cycle and got shut down for life...running a simple dbol cycle at 50 mg a day for 5 weeks. There were younger and older guys that have come and gone that were shut down after 1 or 2 cycles that had bloods drawn and they were at the normal to high end of production before and then there are the guys that can run 5 grams of gear a week and not even have a hint of gyno. Is he risking a shutdown? YES. Will it happen? It remains to be seen. You yourself can bounce back nicely 4 or 5 times then that one cycle halts your production permanently. Its genetics, DNA, family history. No 2 people are the same even if they were born from the same parents. The chances are stronger when your body is developing to shut down when you tell your body to stop doing what it does naturally. For example my brother and I started drinking alcohol at the same age and we were both alcoholics. We were both the same height and weight. He can drink 12 beers and talk to you like he was straight. I would be on the floor passed out. I don't drink anymore but I hope you catch the jest of what I am saying. Any doctor will tell you that when you are growing and something halts that growth; it could stop growing. It's a big chance and game everyone plays with their bodies and after time it can just stop.
RustyhookerYes mother. I'll go to church and say 10 hail Mary's, wish for the flying spaghetti monster, and abstain from sex.
Dude ain't here to learn. He's here to brag. Rub old fuckers nose in shit til he's burnt out and limp docked by 25. There's no misinformation. You're projecting your fears at me instead of at the op.
Turn that mirror and teach him. Not me. I'm old and give 2 shits for kiddies burnt axis. I can legally and with no questions obtain trt as/if needed. This op chose logs to flip the bird. Not ask for help.
As proven in his post of logs vs post in description. Here for karma to whore, rub shit and brag. Nothing more. Nothing less.
You got a show to concentrate on. Focus grasshopper. Focus...
See this is the internet problem, my post was to help both you and him and myself to choose better ways then say cycling young means higher risk for hpta damage. I was trying to say we need to use different techniques to sway young guys from there decisions. They don't care about fried hpta early in life. But when I said he might not have kids maybe that would get to him caue he's in a great relationsip and him an his gf already have there kids names picked out etc. there all I was trying to do. Sway hlm, and come up with better tactics for me an you to sway youngsters away form using gear with explanations that might hit home with them or understand more at that age.
But yes your right I have two goals for the next 5 montsj , finish my two bachelors degrees in May and win my show in July. But it really only care about the show , lol jk. I do tend to put Bodybuidling before everyting which idk if it's a good thing or bad thing. It's good if I really wanna make someting of myself in this sport but bad if I don't have pro aspirations. But either way I can't help it, it consumes me I love it to much. Every aspect of it including doing nothing but reseach on it on a Friday night instead of going out drinking .
RustyhookerDefinitly need to steer youngsters in a better direction. So far I've not seen a young guy post like the op did and have a life altering speech to quit. I basically built the cycle logs. Go to the very beginning of logs, I'm in bout every single one. I don't even try in logs anymore. It turned into brag zone years ago.
I think I've successfully got one person to wait till they're older. So you're right bro. No bed for me to make a long post trying to help. They're not gonna listen. Young guys don't listen. Unless they are extremely mature for their age. If I was into this bak when I was young and wanted to cycle and you told me no I wouldn't care. I was gonna do what I wanted an no one was gonna stop me
RustyhookerThe young guys on here that are being successful and ligical, they're growing, researching and cross checking. They're here. But their style is mature.
AnonI hope that isnt your face in your profile pic...
Why come in asking for advice on a cycle you already started? Are you looking for sympathy or validation since you feel you must use steroids for your job? We dont give advice to guys under 25 for good reason, you can seriously fuck yourself for the rest of your life. Are you gonna be doing this same job when you are 40? Probably not, most people never look that far ahead when they are young. But when you get there and are a slave to the trt needle for the rest of your life, you are gonna look back and wonder what the fuck you were thinking.
And if you truly feel you are addicted, that is all the more reason to stop. Seek professional help, get your mind right. Although I doubt you grasp what a true addiction is like, I am more inclined to believe that is another rationalization for your irresponsible behavior.
Irrespective of what I personally think, this site has a policy on under 25's. Effectively that means you'll get no advice other than "too young" and "don't" etc.
I'm not going to lecture you, I see little point in doing so. I would suggest you readdress your situation, I find your use of the term "addicted" a little disturbing as well as what you're doing using tren and the duration of Winstrol in your cycle.