+ 2 Bloods back Arctic gear, please help! BUN/Creatine
Ok so I thought my prolactin was high. Turns out it's buried!! Estrogen looks right in the middle of the range. BUN is high, glucose is high, creatine, and BUN/creatine are also high. Testosterone is off the charts as expected.
I did not fast before this test, could that have influenced the bun and creatine numbers? Am I just not drinking enough water? Should I be concerned?
If my P is dumped and E Is fine, why in the effing f can I squeeze fluid from areola and nipple? I mean it's not a lot, but I don't think I could do that before. And I do have very slight gyno.
Conclusions:
Arctic Oils: 100% legit
Arctic Caber 100% legit
Arctic adex 100% legit
Anyone with knowledge that can contribute to this please do? What's up with the bun/creatine, and what could be the deal with my nips? WHY DO I HAVE NO SEX DRIVE?
Thanks ahead
***JUST NOTICED I CUT OFF ESTRADIOL
Was at 26.3 range is 7.6-42.6 pg/ml
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AnonSorry I didn't answer your question early, just seen it and it's way down on the bottom of the page now so I'm just going to respond with a new post.
Decreased progesterone/prolactin can cause ED just like too much can cause ED.
Your estrogen is within range but your progesterone is low, this is causing a form of 'estrogen dominance' in your body despite the high levels of test.
Batman did make a good point about your body needing to be in harmony. IIRC you were taking a pretty high dose of caber and AE/AI. Back off the caber a bit, if you're estrogen is staying in range then continuing doing what you're doing there.
Stop playing with your tits too, it's only going to make it worse. Think about a breast feeding woman, they more they do it, they more they produce. The nipple discharge could be considered 'normal' although it's probably not, it could still be residual from your elevated prolactin levels prior to the caber.
Maybe take a few days off everything,
How is your blood pressure? could be a contributing factor
AnonDude great reply i looked up what u said about low prolactin i see no studies in it but i noticed in other forum people who did bloods with low prolactin had low sex drive
+1
In life there is always something new to learn
AnonI can't find much on it either, mostly because this isn't something that would happen naturally.
I read a few patient notes where they experienced loss of libido while on caber. Initially it was improved but later suppressed, this could be from a million different things as most people who use caber for medical reasons have MS or similar conditions.
hyphy, how's your thyroid looking?
That's news to me re: loss of libido and interesting to note. Who knows what combination of circumstances causes this ?Truly our bodies are different and can have unique responses.
LaTTTimer99Well said. Our metabolisms, genetics, so many factors come into play - there's rarely universal truths in this stuff - what works for me may not work at all for someone else, etc.
That's a good question, I don't think it was included in the panel, what would it be listed as?
T3 and T4 I believe. I don't believe it's standard with the female hormone panel.
Ya they weren't on my results :/ I'm gonna get the works done in my pct bloods, lipids, thyroid, everything that is relevant.
If the finances permit, it's nice to do a kitchen sink bloodwork test before a cycle and maybe a month and half after PCT. The one I've been using is Male Athletic Anti-Aging Panel from privatemdlabs - the only thing missing off the top of my head is IGF1, which wouldn't really be a concern unless using HGH.
Yes, good to know and thanks for the suggestion. And the finances do permit, I think I'll start making that routine. If you can afford the gear I think you should be able to afford a couple labs per each cycle to do it right.
Man, that's really great to hear...I agree if you can buy gear, you ought to be able to buy the other stuff, especially labs.
Thanks for the reply. I am cutting off the caber for a little while, and if I start taking it again in a week or two I'll stay at low dose. I will continue at .25mg eod of adex, and also stop playing with my tits :(
My blood pressure was about 140/70 last time I checked, which is slightly elevated, but significantly lower than before I started taking the baby aspirin and upped my fish oil.
I will be dropping the deca in a couple weeks here and we'll see what happens then. I miss being the horny, wants to bang everything with a pulse guy that my girl loves so much. It's a shame really because if you look in my pics you will see she is a bombshell, and I'm just never in the mood! It's starting to be an issue with her cause she's ready to go 24/7.
Thanks again for your help.
AnonDamn, that's rough brother. Hopefully everything returns to normal shortly.
Ya. Anyway, I really appreciate your help and want to thank you again for your services. From turn time to quality with your gear, Arctic is fully on point! I've never been able to order with the 100% confidence I can with you guys. Please don't go closing shop for too long!
AnonThe high amounts of nitrogens in ur blood stream are probaly effecting ur libido and effecting ur homestatic enviornment to cuase an erection and ur well being to feel horny.
Does bun really affect libido? I don't have problems with erection, it's just I'm not in the mood very often.
AnonThe libido part is a hypothesis of mine ur blood stream isnt in perfect harmony right now
AnonAite BUN means blood urea nitrogen, urea is a part of ur urine it means that ur kidneys are not working properly and ur nephron's glomurus is not excreating in a correct manner, also urea comes from amino acids, which means ur probaly eating too much protien, lay off the protien ur putting ur kidneys at risk. Creatinine is a product from working out when ur muscle catabolize amd also when its low usally means ur not drinking enough water but u have it high, it means ur kidney arent excreating it well either and also it means ur liver is suffering cuase its not doing its job in controling its amount. Stop the gear! Ur heading in a very dangerous direction u may end up in dialysis.
You have a thorough understanding of the medical situation here, but not how it applies in a real world situation when someone is juicing. I did not fast before the test so all these levels will be inflated. It is normal for someone who is on a high protein diet and on gear who didn't fast to test at higher bun and creatine levels, I have learned. I don't have any real cause for concern, I just need to drink more water.
Thank you for your input though, I did actually learn something, and I appreciate you breaking it down for me. I just don't feel like you are taking all of the variables and factors that could influence these results into account.
I assure you I am not heading for Dialysis. I am confident that had I fasted, or had more adequate fluid intake, these numbers would have been lower, and as soon as in discontinue the gear in pct, these numbers will return to baseline.
My liver values are also fine, and I don't even drink. I think you are just looking at the numbers and over reacting. I appreciate the concern though.
AnonSorry i didnt reead that u didnt fast my bad that changes everything that blood is inaccurate next time fast for at least 10hrs
Well fasting won't change the test, estradiol, and prolactin levels that I was mostly concerned with. I will fast before my pct levels.
AnonTrue but pretaining to the BUN/creatinie it will significantly change it. Good luck man if anything try cialis, or aphrodisiacs
Ya but cialis is for ed, I don't have ed. I'm just never in the mood to have sex, and never pursue it with my girl and she is fine as Fuck and always ready to go! Usually on cycle I'm wanting to go multiple times a day!
I can get hard no problem once I actually get started, it's just I never actually want to...
maybe youre into guys?
LaTTTimer99Great input here guy - way to contribute to the thread lol
Bahaha! I know, right!? Gotta admit it made me laugh when I read it tho
Haha! I hate to disappoint you but that's not the case.
beyondimportsUnrelated, I'm curious of your rbc and hematocrit on eq since it trashes mine
I added that page. Sorry it's rotated, it did that no matter what I tried. I was concerned about that too, but they were all in range.
The only thing still in question is my lipid profile.
Unfortunately your lab doesn't give you your test levels (don't know why they do that for some people, mine always does) but if your testosterone is really high (and it should be at your dose) that could lower your libido big time. If I go much over 200mg of Test E a week my sex drive is nothing..... I for sure wouldn't drop the Arimidex unless you want boobs... Looks like your E level is perfect. Not sure on the fluid from the nips but definitly stop playing with it. I had it before and it didn't stop untill I left it alone.
It does give test levels, they are off the charts at > 1500mg/nl (greater than).
And I'm not dropping the adex never said I was, I'm dropping the caber to let my prolactin level raise a little bit.
And regarding high test lowering sex drive... I believe you may be misinformed there. Testosterone is directly related to sex drive. That's why when people supplement exogenous test, sex drive increases. I should be a walking hard on with the test levels I have, I believe it's my low P that's messing with me now.
How can I be misinformed about my own body? I think I'm pretty aware of my own sex drive..... It says above 1500 so it could be 1510 or it could be 6000+..... Big difference!
Ok, my only point is 200mg/week is hormone replacement levels so that should only restore natural libido. Anything up at 500mg and where I'm at should definitely result in an increased libido. I'd you're saying that isn't true for you that's fine, no reason to get defensive. You are right, and everyone is different.
But I don't care if my test levels are 1510mg or 6000mg, theoretically my libido should be heightened.
Perhaps your lack of libido with higher test levels is due to the heightened untreated estrogen levels that come with it.
Yep, your right, everyone is different. I was just was trying to share some information with you is all. I definitely don't leave my estrogen levels untreated BTW. I was just mentioning the T levels because 1500 is about where my libido starts to drop. If it goes to like 6000 I just have no interest in sex at all..
Hmmm very interesting. I wonder why that is. My libido was raging towards the beginning if my cycle when my levels were just building, but the deca hadn't kicked in yet either so I attributed it to that.
Low prolactin hasn't done anything to my libido...just throwing it out there. These damn random erections can be annoying sometimes. Having said that see what happens when you discontinue the caber.
Ya we'll see. Doesn't really seem to be any negative effects linked with low P, unless of course long term.
Maybe it's just the nandrolone that kills my libido for some reason. I remember it being not so high on my npp cycle as well. We'll see what happens when I stop the deca here in a couple weeks and continue with test/eq only.
Bun will be high on a high protein diet that is normal increase your fluid intake. Not a big deal as your ratio is 21. Glucose can be high as you did not fast any sugar or carb you ate before the test will make it rise.
I agree with BB drop the caber.
Here's a question what are you running??? I take it is some form of a 19-nor.(Tren,Deca,NPP) ?
Yes 300mg deca weekly, along with test e 600mg and eq 800mg weekly. kick started with drol first four weeks 50mg/day.
How long should I discontinue caber for?
Continue regular adex dosage?
Is the low P responsible for my low sex drive?
Why are my nips still acting up?
Thank you
How long you been on this cycle?
In answer to your questions.
I would just drop it. Being at .3 tells me you don't need it. Always weigh the risk and reward when taking something. The risk of caber, it is know to cause heart valve damage. You don't need it now. But I understand why you started on it till you got your bloods done. The other risk is that Hypoprolactinaemia can cause immune supression. Prolactin acts as an important regulator of the immune system. Low levels also causes asthenospermia. Your sperm doesn't swim to good which is a major cause of infertility. There's more but you get the point. When ever you drop below a range it can cause some type of problem. So let it get back up.
I would continue on with the Adex at the same dose. Your estradiol is perfect so it's not causing your sore nips as long as you had been maintaining that dose through out your cycle. What I mean is your snap shot of your blood shows that estradiol is not the problem.
Could be but I don't think so.
I think the Androl caused you nips to act up. You see Androl works by a different mode than say Dbol. Oxymetholone does not convert to estrogen. So an aromatase inhibitor is not going to help. It's mode of action is at the receptor.So you need to use a SERM (Selective estrogen receptor modulators) such as Nolva or clomid which act as antagonist in breast tissue. I would use Nolva at 40mg a day to start. If you don't have any nolva then use clomid. Run it for a week and see if you notice a change.
The question you need to ask yourself is what's different with this cycle. I know you have run a 19-nor before. So why didn't you have a problem before? What changed? The combinations? The dosage? The compounds?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prolactin
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8191163
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8683690
http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/drugsatfda_docs/label/2004/16848s021lbl.pdf.
I'm in about week 10, planning on runnin the deca for only a couple more weeks, and the eq and test until about 17 and 18.
I thought nolva was a no no with a 19 nor?
I previously ran npp, so it doesn't aromatize like deca, maybe that was the issue. And this was also my first run with adrol. What could be the cause if the low sex drive? And why haven't my nips dried up yet?
I appreciate your help. I will drop the caber immediately.
Thanks again
Mega, I have great respect for your take on bloodwork, but regarding the heart valve damage risk, it has to be pointed out, these assessements appear to have been done on Parkinson's disease patients who have taken a daily high dose of caber for long term treatment related to this disease. Note in the following links the doses are greater than 3mg per day.
http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/showthread.php?t=4238
http://jcem.endojournals.org/content/95/3/1025.long
For our purposes we don't use at such a high dosage at such a high frequency and for a long period of time. There's always a risk, but I'm just trying to put it that risk in perspective.
Regarding asthenospermia...now that's something new to me (I suppose immune system regulation). This may call into question the standard protocol of 0.25mg e3d as this protocol can drop prolactin levels below range. Maybe this may need to be adjusted so prolactin levels stay in an optimal range - assuming that's the recognized range for men. It's late where I am, so I'll have to read later. I need to go through your links closer and see if there's any information regarding how long the body can tolerate low levels before degradation of sperm function and immune system. Just for reference and from what I've seen, after completion of a cycle and PCT, and time off, prolactin levels do rise again and go back to standard levels.
In this case, as I recall the OP did use a higher than typical dosage in order to alleviate what appeared to be prolactin related symptoms. Cessation of usage might also be recommended due to this. Otherwise, those questions you've posed need to be asked as there's still no answer as to the cause of the OPs issue.
Yes, so why the most nips and no sex drive?? Scratching my head...
AnonYour prolactin is too low, stop the caber
You know I could not find a reason why low prolactin, unlike estrogen, would be bad for men. What could be a possible issue with too low of a level? Just genuinely curious....
Ya, stop it completely? For how long? Do you know anything about the bun/creatine? Why do I still have moist nips??
Oops
your estrogen is WAY TOO LOW.
also stop squeezing your nips, that will make it worse!
26 is low? It's in the middle of the range. Where should it be?
oh nvm thought it said 0.3 my bad still half asleep lol